Haha love the Alan Rickman question. While I will always and forever be a huge Alan Rickman fan and will happily watch his performance in anything, I actually love David Morrissey’s Colonel Brandon in the 2008 BBC miniseries. This might be because my first exposure to Alan Rickman was as Professor Snape, but I also think the 2008 version spends a little more time on Colonel Brandon’s character (such as by showing him interacting with his ward and depicting the duel that is only mentioned in a lot of other versions).
I think it’s possible (though perhaps only a distant possibility) that Marianne and Willoughby could have been happy together. I think that they would both have to go through a lot of growth and heartache before getting to a point of being able to have a stable, happy marriage. There are definitely couples who start off in similar positions and mature into a healthy, dependable relationship, but for two rather self-absorbed people who have more high-flying emotion than virtue, I would say it’s a pretty risky gamble. Given his track record, I think it’s likely that Willoughby could prove to be unfaithful if the relationship went through a rocky period.
You are absolutely right, based on Willoughby’s track record and the allusions to his financial troubles, that marriage might start out exciting and than quickly become very difficult. Neither of them seem to have any sense of love as sacrifice for the other, and when the rough times inevitably show up, they will both be ill-equipped to grow through it.
Marianne and Willoughby would have been MISERABLE together. Marianne would have been despondent the first time she caught him cheating (which you know he would do) and he would have used her emotional instability as another reason to (in the best case) ignore/avoid her even more. Bad news all around!!
My sister once described one of my brother’s relationships as follows: “I think they could have a really happy life together if they never encounter any problems.”
I think the same applies to Maryann and Willoughby - both are immature, one is certainly lacking in ethics and principles, but Maryann has at least some good sense (see e.g. how she quickly identifies the lack of it in so many other characters) and they really did love each other, albeit with a love founded more on chemistry than character. So odds are slim, but I think, given his wealth and her good temper, and if nothing ever tested either of those things, they could have been happy.
PS my brother did indeed break up with that girl 😂
PPS of course it’s Alan Rickman - because any portrayal that can make you fall a little bit in love with professor Snape and the bad guy in Die Hard is indeed extraordinary
I didn't realize how much I liked Alan Rickman until I saw him in this movie! And I didn't see the movie until like a year ago. The casting in the Emma Thompson movie just seems perfect all round.
I love how Austen universalizes Proverb 31:30 for both men and women - "Charm is deceitful and beauty is vain, but a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised." A man like Colonel Brandon is to be praised, and most of the charm demonstrated by men and women deceitfully covers up poor character.
I am Team Brandon all the way! His strength and depth of character being revealed was so satisfying. Is there a list somewhere of the movie adaptations for each of the novels? I’m going into most of these books without having seen the movies because I wanted my reading experience to be unbiased.
I don’t think Marianne and Willoughby would have even made it through the first year of marriage. They are too much alike, both lacking constancy. All I could think when I read of Willoughby’s misdeeds was how lucky Marianne was to have escaped any further relationship with him. He is a scoundrel!
I think it is next to impossible for Willoughby and Marianne to have been happy long term. Elinor says it best “his demands and your inexperience together, on a small, a very small income” would have led to serious difficulties. And had Marianne tried to curb Willoughby’s behavior/expenses she would likely have “lessened [her] influence on his heart, and made him regret the connection which had involved him in such difficulties.” As is the car with Henry Crawford, Willoughby’s love of a virtuous/good woman is born out of a desire to please/flirt for the sake of entertainment, and no love that has such a selfish beginning can truly end well. Both Willoughby and Henry Crawford try to be better people for the sake of the women they love, but they see being “good” as a means to an end, not an end in and of itself (which is how Darcy goes about his transformation for the better). And I actually ended up writing about this whole issue because of all the reading and thinking I’ve been doing due to this Year of Jane! https://open.substack.com/pub/commonplacecatholic/p/falling-for-henry-crawford?r=1fiwok&utm_medium=ios&utm_campaign=post
I agree with everyone who has said that Marianne and Willoughby’s marriage would have been difficult. They were both too self-absorbed.
Unrelated, something that has been bothering me on this reread, is how Elinor chooses repeatedly to keep Lucy’s secret and keep her family in the dark. I think it would have been ok for her to tell her mother and sisters and spare them (and herself) all of the weeks/months where they thought she and Edward were together. It also would have given her someone to confide in and get her feelings out.
I wonder if she couldn’t trust them to keep the secret? Part of her character development seems to be that she needs to be more open to those around her vs keeping everything to herself.
Haha love the Alan Rickman question. While I will always and forever be a huge Alan Rickman fan and will happily watch his performance in anything, I actually love David Morrissey’s Colonel Brandon in the 2008 BBC miniseries. This might be because my first exposure to Alan Rickman was as Professor Snape, but I also think the 2008 version spends a little more time on Colonel Brandon’s character (such as by showing him interacting with his ward and depicting the duel that is only mentioned in a lot of other versions).
I think it’s possible (though perhaps only a distant possibility) that Marianne and Willoughby could have been happy together. I think that they would both have to go through a lot of growth and heartache before getting to a point of being able to have a stable, happy marriage. There are definitely couples who start off in similar positions and mature into a healthy, dependable relationship, but for two rather self-absorbed people who have more high-flying emotion than virtue, I would say it’s a pretty risky gamble. Given his track record, I think it’s likely that Willoughby could prove to be unfaithful if the relationship went through a rocky period.
I agree! I think Willoughby's tendencies to focus entirely on immediate gratification would make him resentful of Marianne over time.
You are absolutely right, based on Willoughby’s track record and the allusions to his financial troubles, that marriage might start out exciting and than quickly become very difficult. Neither of them seem to have any sense of love as sacrifice for the other, and when the rough times inevitably show up, they will both be ill-equipped to grow through it.
Marianne and Willoughby would have been MISERABLE together. Marianne would have been despondent the first time she caught him cheating (which you know he would do) and he would have used her emotional instability as another reason to (in the best case) ignore/avoid her even more. Bad news all around!!
My sister once described one of my brother’s relationships as follows: “I think they could have a really happy life together if they never encounter any problems.”
I think the same applies to Maryann and Willoughby - both are immature, one is certainly lacking in ethics and principles, but Maryann has at least some good sense (see e.g. how she quickly identifies the lack of it in so many other characters) and they really did love each other, albeit with a love founded more on chemistry than character. So odds are slim, but I think, given his wealth and her good temper, and if nothing ever tested either of those things, they could have been happy.
PS my brother did indeed break up with that girl 😂
PPS of course it’s Alan Rickman - because any portrayal that can make you fall a little bit in love with professor Snape and the bad guy in Die Hard is indeed extraordinary
I didn't realize how much I liked Alan Rickman until I saw him in this movie! And I didn't see the movie until like a year ago. The casting in the Emma Thompson movie just seems perfect all round.
It's SO good. Such good casting.
I love how Austen universalizes Proverb 31:30 for both men and women - "Charm is deceitful and beauty is vain, but a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised." A man like Colonel Brandon is to be praised, and most of the charm demonstrated by men and women deceitfully covers up poor character.
I am Team Brandon all the way! His strength and depth of character being revealed was so satisfying. Is there a list somewhere of the movie adaptations for each of the novels? I’m going into most of these books without having seen the movies because I wanted my reading experience to be unbiased.
I don’t think Marianne and Willoughby would have even made it through the first year of marriage. They are too much alike, both lacking constancy. All I could think when I read of Willoughby’s misdeeds was how lucky Marianne was to have escaped any further relationship with him. He is a scoundrel!
Maybe I'll create a post with all my recommendations!
I second that list request! :)
Yes please!!
My first love was Colonel Brandon (and especially Alan Rickman's portrayal of him). When he started reciting poetry I was done!
I think it is next to impossible for Willoughby and Marianne to have been happy long term. Elinor says it best “his demands and your inexperience together, on a small, a very small income” would have led to serious difficulties. And had Marianne tried to curb Willoughby’s behavior/expenses she would likely have “lessened [her] influence on his heart, and made him regret the connection which had involved him in such difficulties.” As is the car with Henry Crawford, Willoughby’s love of a virtuous/good woman is born out of a desire to please/flirt for the sake of entertainment, and no love that has such a selfish beginning can truly end well. Both Willoughby and Henry Crawford try to be better people for the sake of the women they love, but they see being “good” as a means to an end, not an end in and of itself (which is how Darcy goes about his transformation for the better). And I actually ended up writing about this whole issue because of all the reading and thinking I’ve been doing due to this Year of Jane! https://open.substack.com/pub/commonplacecatholic/p/falling-for-henry-crawford?r=1fiwok&utm_medium=ios&utm_campaign=post
I agree with everyone who has said that Marianne and Willoughby’s marriage would have been difficult. They were both too self-absorbed.
Unrelated, something that has been bothering me on this reread, is how Elinor chooses repeatedly to keep Lucy’s secret and keep her family in the dark. I think it would have been ok for her to tell her mother and sisters and spare them (and herself) all of the weeks/months where they thought she and Edward were together. It also would have given her someone to confide in and get her feelings out.
I wonder if she couldn’t trust them to keep the secret? Part of her character development seems to be that she needs to be more open to those around her vs keeping everything to herself.
That's a good point. Could she not have at least told them the mere fact of Edward being taken but say she can't disclose any further yet?